The Third Leg of Firm-Building

marathon, race, third leg

Five years ago, I wrote a piece about the third leg of the race. From my time as a competitive swimmer, the lesson our coach always had for us was if you’re swimming anything more than two laps, the most important part of every race is the third leg. Everyone’s tired. Everyone’s gasping for air. Yet everyone wants to win. The question is who wants it more. And by the time you get to a decently high level, everyone’s athleticism is about the same. All that matters is the mentality you have on that third segment of four of each race.

We often say, that starting a company or a fund is a marathon, not a sprint. True in a lot of ways. But also, it’s a series of sprints within a marathon.

We put out an episode last week with the amazing Ben Choi, which I really can’t stop recommending. Just because I learn something new every time I talk with Ben, and this time especially so. But that’s my own bias, and I get it. But more interestingly, he said something that I couldn’t get out of my mind since we recorded. “The first three fundsโ€”not just the first two, the first threeโ€”are that ‘working-out’ process. Most pragmatically, there’s very little performance to be seen by Fund III. So it’s actually Fund IV for us to hold up the manager as no longer emerging and now needs to earn its own place in the portfolio.” The timestamp is at 16:21 if you’re curious.

And it got me thinking… is Fund III that third leg of the race?

When most GPs raise Fund III, they’re usually four, maybe five years, out from their Fund I. And that’s assuming they started deploying as soon as they raised their fund. And within five years, not that much changes. Usually, that’s two funding rounds after your first investments. But lemons ripen early, so only a small, small subset move to Series A or B. Most have raised one or less subsequent round since the GP committed capital.

Even accounting for two funding rounds later, that’s usually too early to consider selling into the next round. And if one does (unless it’s a heavily diversified portfolio and the GP has no information rights, and somehow is so far removed from the company that no one at the company talks to the GP anymore), then there’s signaling risk. Because:

  1. No matter what portfolio strategy you run, not staying in touch with your best performing companies is a cardinal sin. Not only can you not use those companies as references (which LPs do look for), you also can’t say your deal flow increased meaningfully over time. No senior executive or early employee knows who you are. So if they leave the company and start their own, they wouldn’t pitch you. Your network doesn’t get better over time. See my gratitude essay for more depth here.
  2. Not having any information rights and/or visibility is another problem. Do the founders not trust you? Do you have major investor’s rights? How are you managing follow-on investment decision makingโ€”whether that’s through reserves or SPVs? Are the blind leading the blind?
  3. And if you do run a diversified portfolio, where optically selling early may not be as reputationally harmful to the company, you are losing out on the power law. And for a diversified portfolio, say a 50-company portfolio. You need a 50X on an individual investment to return the fund. 150X if you want to 3X the fund. As opposed to a concentrated 20-company portfolio, where you only need 20X to return the fund and 60X to 3X. As such, selling too early meaningfully caps your upside for an asset class that is one of the few power law-driven ones. As Jamie Rhode once said, โ€œIf youโ€™re compounding at 25% for 12 years, that turns into a 14.9X. If youโ€™re compounding at 14%, thatโ€™s a 5. And the public market which is 11% gets you a 3.5X. [โ€ฆ] If the asset is compounding at a venture-like CAGR, donโ€™t sell out early because youโ€™re missing out on a huge part of that ultimate multiple. For us, weโ€™re taxable investors. I have to go pay taxes on that asset you sold out of early and go find another asset compounding at 25%.โ€ Taking it a step further, assuming 12-year fund cycles, and 25% IRR, โ€œthe last 20% of time produces 46% of that return.โ€ And that’s just the last three years of a fund, much less sooner.
  4. Finally, any early DPI you do get up to Fund I t+5 years is negligible. Anything under 0.5X, and for some LPs, anything sub-1X, isn’t any more inspiring to invest in than if you had absolutely no DPI.

Yet despite all of the above, the only thing you can prove to LPs are the inputs. Not the outputs. You can prove that you invested in the same number of companies as you promised. You can prove that you’re pacing in the same manner as you promised. And you can prove that founders take the same check size and offer the same ownership to you as you promised. And that is always good. As you raise from friends and family and early believers in Fund I, Fund III’s raise usually inches towards smaller institutions, but larger checks than you likely had in Fund I.

  1. Fund-of-funds care about legibility. Logos. Outliers. Realistically, if you didn’t have any before Fund I, the likelihood of you having any while raising Fund III is slim. They need to tell a story to their LPs. A story of access and getting in on gems that no one else has heard of, but if everyone knew, they’d fight to get in.
  2. Any person you pitch to who has any string of three to four letters (or is hired to be a professional manager) attached to their name (i.e. MBA, CAIA, CFA, CPA, etc.) has a job. For many, their incentive unless their track record speaks for itself (likely not, given how long venture funds take to fully return capital) is to “not get fired for buying IBM.” Some of their year-end bonuses are attached to that. Some lack the bandwidth and the team members to fully immerse themselves in the true craft of emerging manager investing. Many times, the incentive structure is outside of their immediate hands. For every bet they make that isn’t obvious, they risk career suicide. At least within that institution.

I’m obviously generalizing. While this may be true for 90%+ of LPs who fit in these categories, there are obviously outliers. Never judge a book by its cover. But it’s often helpful to set your expectations realistically.

As such, despite not much changing from your investment side, from the eyes of most LPs, you are graduating to larger and larger LP checks. Usually because of the need to provide more proof points towards the ultimate fund strategy you would like to deploy when you’re ‘established.’ But to each new set of LPs, prior to an institutional 8-year track record, you’re still new. On top of that, as your fund size likely grows a bit in size from Fund I, to some LPs, you are drifting from your initial strategy by no longer being participatory and now leading and co-leading. You also might have added a new partner, like Ben talks about in the afore-mentioned episode. And a new strategy and a new team requires new proof points related to on-thesis investments. So, Fund III is where you begin to need to whether the storm. For some, that may start from Fund II. Altos Ventures took four years to raise their Fund II. Many others I know struggled to do the same. But if you really want to be in VC long term, this is the third leg of the race.

And this is when a lot of GPs start tapping out. Will you?

Photo by Victoire Joncheray on Unsplash


Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

Timeless VS Just-In-Time Lessons | Earnest Sweat & Alexa Binns | Superclusters | S6PSE1

earnest sweat, alexa binns

The holiday season has always been a great time to celebrate the movers and shakers in our world. This season we’re celebrating my personal favorites in the LP world. To start this mini-holiday series off, Earnest Sweat and Alexa Binns runs one of the most popular podcasts on venture capital limited partners, Swimming with Allocators. I was also fortunate enough to be on their podcast as well as a bonus crossover episode.

You can find Earnest on his socials here:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/earnestsweat/
X / Twitter: https://x.com/EarnestSweat

You can find Alexa on her socials here:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexabinns/
X / Twitter: https://x.com/alexabinns

Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also watch the episode on YouTube here.

OUTLINE:

[00:00] Intro
[02:09] Alexa’s earliest relationship with money
[03:28] Earnest’s earliest relationship with money
[04:45] Earnest’s first major purchase
[06:41] Alexa’s first major purchase
[08:25] The difference between public speaking and interviewing
[12:19] Memorable guests on the SwA podcast
[14:46] To do or not to do in-person interviews
[18:05] Evolution of YouTube titles
[20:04] Why err towards evergreen content?
[22:30] Was SwA designed for LPs or GPs?
[24:12] How did Earnest and Alexa meet?
[24:56] How did Swimming with Allocators start?
[27:21] The Pandora’s Box of intros
[28:02] Alexa’s 3 buckets for LP investing
[30:12] What is ‘coming soon’ for Earnest and Alexa?
[36:58] Post-credit scene: Spider-Man & Investors as Avengers

SELECT LINKS FROM THIS EPISODE:

SELECT QUOTES FROM THIS EPISODE:

โ€œHaving done my investment philosophy, Iโ€™ve got three buckets. There is the โ€˜Let it ride, you canโ€™t beat the marketโ€™ bucket. Thatโ€™s the majority of what Iโ€™m working with. Thatโ€™s 90[%] plus. There is a bucket where Iโ€™ve worked as a VC, Iโ€™ve managed a bunch of LP investments, I am better suited to vet deals than the average person. I believe in my ability to pick winners in this very thin layer of finance. Just in angel investing and GP selection where Iโ€™ve got lived experience and then my network. And then thereโ€™s a bucket for other ways capital can make your life richer.โ€ โ€” Alexa Binns


Follow David Zhou for more Superclusters content:
For podcast show notes: https://cupofzhou.com/superclusters
Follow David Zhou’s blog: https://cupofzhou.com
Follow Superclusters on Twitter: https://twitter.com/SuperclustersLP
Follow Superclusters on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@super.clusters
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Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

When Do You Know If You’ve Grown Up as a VC? | El Pack w/ Ben Choi | Superclusters

ben choi

Ben Choi from Next Legacy joins David on El Pack to answer your questions on how to build a venture capital fund. We bring on 3 GPs at VC funds to ask 3 different questions.

Gilgamesh Ventures’ Miguel Armaza, also host of the incredible Fintech Leaders podcast, asks Ben what is the timing of when a GP should consider raising a Fund III.

Similarly, but not the same, Strange Ventures’ Tara Tan asks when an LP backs a Fund I, how do they know that this Fund I GP will last till Fund III.

Arkane Capital’s Arkady Kulik asks how one should think about building an LP community, especially as he brings in new and different LP archetypes into Arkane’s ecosystem.

Ben manages over $3.5B investments with premier venture capital firms as well as directly in early stage startups. He brings to Next Legacy a distinguished track record spanning three decades in the technology ecosystem.

Benโ€™s love for technology products formed the basis for his successful venture track record, including pre-PMF investments in Marketo (acquired for $4.75B) and CourseHero (last valued at $3.6B). He previously ran product for Adobeโ€™s Creative Cloud offerings and founded CoffeeTable, where he raised venture capital financing, built a team, and ultimately sold the company.

Ben is an alum and Board Member of the Society of Kauffman Fellows (venture capital leadership) and has also served his community on the Board of Directors for the San Francisco Chinese Culture Center, Childrenโ€™s Health Council, Church of the Pioneers Foundation, and IVCF.

Ben studied Computer Science at Harvard University before Mark Zuckerberg made it cool and received his MBA from Columbia Business School. Born in Peoria, raised in San Francisco, and educated in Cambridge, Ben now lives in Los Altos with his wife, Lydia, three very active sons, and a ball python.

You can find Ben on his socials here:
X / Twitter: https://x.com/benjichoi
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bchoi/

Listen to the episode onย Apple Podcastsย andย Spotify. You can alsoย watch the episode on YouTube here.

OUTLINE:

[00:00] Intro
[05:05] Ben’s 2025 Halloween costume
[06:44] Jensen Huang’s leather jackets
[07:24] Jensen Huang’s answer to Ben’s one question
[10:05] Enter Miguel, Gilgamesh Ventures, Fintech Leaders
[14:43] What are good signals an LP looks for before a GP raises a Fund III?
[22:35] Why does Ben say ‘established’ starts at Fund IV?
[25:08] Who’s the audience for Miguel’s podcast?
[27:52] In case you want more like this…
[28:32] Enter Tara and Strange Ventures
[32:46] How does Ben know a Fund I will become a Fund III?
[36:53] How does Ben know if a GP will want to build an enduring career?
[40:58] How does Tara share a future GP she’d like to work with to Ben?
[42:43] Marriage and divorce rates in America
[43:34] What should a Fund I do to institutionalize?
[46:28] Should you share LP updates to current or prospective LPs?
[48:57] Enter Arkady and Arkane Capital
[51:09] How does one think through LP-community fit?
[1:01:31] What’s Arkady’s favorite board game?
[1:03:08] Ben’s last piece of advice to GPs
[1:09:50] My favorite Ben moment on Superclusters

SELECT LINKS FROM THIS EPISODE:

SELECT QUOTES FROM THIS EPISODE:

โ€œThe dance of fundraising is when you do have [your thesis], the LP has to figure out is this a rationalization of the past or is it actually what happened? Was this known at the time? Because if it was, we can have some confidence in the future going forward. But if it was just a rationalization of some randomness, then itโ€™s hard to know if Fund IV or V or VI will benefit from the same pattern.โ€ โ€” Ben Choi

On solo GPs bringing in future partners by Fund IIIโ€ฆ โ€œThe future unidentified partner is the largest risk that we have to decide to accept. So there actually isnโ€™t a moment where we decide this GP is going to be around for Fund III. Itโ€™s actually the dominating risk we look at and we get there, but itโ€™s a preponderance of other things that we need to build our conviction so high that weโ€™re willing to take that risk.โ€ โ€” Ben Choi

โ€œItโ€™s brutal. Itโ€™s a 30-year journey. For any GP who raises a single dollar from external LPs, itโ€™s a 30-year journey.โ€ โ€” Tara Tan

โ€œI donโ€™t think anyone goes into this business to raise capital, but your ability to raise capital is ultimately what allows you to be in this business.โ€ โ€” Ben Choi

On communityโ€ฆ โ€œYour core question is how much diversityโ€”in the technical term of diversityโ€”can you tolerate before you lose the sense of community.โ€ โ€” Ben Choi

โ€œMost letters from a parent contain a parent’s own lost dreams disguised as good advice.โ€ โ€” Kurt Vonnegut

โ€œFundraising is a journey of finding investors who want what you have to offer; itโ€™s not convincing somebody to do something.โ€ โ€” Ben Choi


Follow David Zhou for more Superclusters content:
For podcast show notes: https://cupofzhou.com/superclusters
Follow David Zhou’s blog: https://cupofzhou.com
Follow Superclusters on Twitter: https://twitter.com/SuperclustersLP
Follow Superclusters on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@super.clusters
Follow Superclusters on Instagram: https://instagram.com/super.clusters


Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

“Venture Should Play More Like Moneyball” | Carson Monson | Superclusters | S6E9

carson monson

“The limiting downside is actually something a lot of emerging managers donโ€™t think about. If you can turn all of your portfolio companies that donโ€™t hit that exit velocity, if you can find a soft landing for those companies versus thatโ€™s a writeoff and theyโ€™re dead and done, thatโ€™s extra effort, but thatโ€™s an extra turn on your fundโ€™s performance.” โ€” Carson Monson

Carson Monson is a seasoned allocator with nearly a decade of experience backing emerging and spinout GPs across large institutions, government entities, and family offices. After stints at Greenspring, SITFO, and building a fund of funds strategy for a large European single family office, he now runs the fund of funds at CrossRange, which focuses on supporting top-tier emerging and spinout GPs.

Carson has backed everything from micro funds to high-profile managers spinning out of tier-one firms. He is deeply committed to being a thought partner and strategic resource to the GPs he supports, helping them navigate the complexities of fund building and long-term success in the VC industry.

You can find Carson on his socials here:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/carson-k-monson/
X / Twitter: https://x.com/Monsson_

Listen to the episode onย Apple Podcastsย andย Spotify. You can alsoย watch the episode on YouTube here.

OUTLINE:

[00:00] Intro
[02:08] Wildlife and wholesome trouble
[06:03] The journey to being an LP
[10:54] How did Carson join Greenspring?
[13:55] Lessons across Greenspring
[15:46] How many deals did Greenspring do per year?
[18:46] An example of a qualitative metric worth measuring
[20:16] How many off-thesis bets is a VC allowed to make?
[21:25] When do GPs move from thematic bets to opportunistic bets?
[25:45] How much AUM should any one GP have?
[29:46] Why does Carson liked concentrated portfolios?
[30:32] The case for concentrated portfolios
[36:40] Relationships with GPs should stay at the LP partner level
[39:49] Fund strategy at Fund (n) vs Fund (n + 1)
[45:19] What the hell is ‘critical node theory?’
[49:54] Examples of great references
[52:58] The halo effect of mega funds
[58:48] How does Carson get to inbox zero
[1:02:09] Why is CrossRange different?
[1:08:17] The last time Carson had a pinch-me moment
[1:10:17] Carson’s ricotta gnocchi
[1:12:28] Post-credit scene: Ramen, gluten, Tokyo, and Tonkatsu Suzuki Pt 2

SELECT LINKS FROM THIS EPISODE:

SELECT QUOTES FROM THIS EPISODE:

On if 20% of the fund is focused on opportunistic betsโ€ฆ โ€œWealthy is a nice word. I would say [20% is] egregious. […] 10%, itโ€™s not like itโ€™s the right number, but itโ€™s the number most LPs wonโ€™t contest.โ€ โ€” Carson Monson

โ€œIn the past, there have been GPs who are truly excellent at one thing or a couple of things, whether thatโ€™s a thesis, strategy, or an approach. And that approach makes a ton of sense at the fund size that theyโ€™re operating at or maybe a little bit larger. In the 20-teens especially, people were able to raise more and more, and strategy drift became a huge issue. That is something managers have to face the music on now. Itโ€™s almost like the idea of being a professional baseball player and grinding and working your way up and becoming excellent and an all-star baseball player. Then being, โ€˜Well, the motion is similar in cricket, so Iโ€™ll just go play cricket now.โ€™ Ya some of the motions are similar, but itโ€™s a fundamentally different sport. Strategy drift, fund size drift; it can be a really easy trap to fall into. The motions are similar, but you lose that competitive edge when you start to play a different sport.โ€ โ€” Carson Monson

โ€œIf youโ€™re more concentrated, there is an ability to impact outcomes more meaningfully. I like GPs that play a critical role in the ecosystem in which they operate in. If you play a critical roleโ€”whether thatโ€™s in go-to-market motions, whether thatโ€™s in commercialization, whether thatโ€™s in branding and storytellingโ€”there are so many ways you can play that role. Those types of GPs tend to have an ability to move the needle for their founders moreโ€”both on the upside and limiting the downside.โ€ โ€” Carson Monson

โ€œThe limiting downside is actually something a lot of emerging managers donโ€™t think about. If you can turn all of your portfolio companies that donโ€™t hit that exit velocity, if you can find a soft landing for those companies versus thatโ€™s a writeoff and theyโ€™re dead and done, thatโ€™s extra effort, but thatโ€™s an extra turn on your fundโ€™s performance. There is a skillset in identifying that thereโ€™s still good in a company, even if itโ€™s not going to have this massive outcome.โ€ โ€” Carson Monson

โ€œVenture should play more like Moneyball. If you can get your companies on base and limit strikeouts, that is actually so impactful at a fund level. More emerging managers should try to think like CIOs, and less like individual investors, like being a portfolio manager and managing outcomes. Obviously, venture is a game of minority positions. You do not have sole control. Playing that role for your founders, it impacts performance. It impacts reputation and, in fact, your ability to win in the future.โ€ โ€” Carson Monson

โ€œYou cannot say, โ€˜Iโ€™m going to be SV Angel today, so I can be USV tomorrow.โ€™โ€ โ€” Carson Monson

โ€œA multi-billion dollar mega fund has to have a portfolio of companies whose aggregate equity value outstrips the GDP of most small nations on this planet.โ€ โ€” Carson Monson


Follow David Zhou for more Superclusters content:
For podcast show notes: https://cupofzhou.com/superclusters
Follow David Zhou’s blog: https://cupofzhou.com
Follow Superclusters on Twitter: https://twitter.com/SuperclustersLP
Follow Superclusters on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@super.clusters
Follow Superclusters on Instagram: https://instagram.com/super.clusters


Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

Underwriting Things That Don’t Change

sequoia tree, does not change

One of the most interesting lines I heard on a podcast that Mike Maples was on was: “90% of our exit profits have come from pivots.” Which I first wrote here. Then here. It’s a line that lives rent free in my mind. Ideas, startups, roadmaps, and goals change all the time. I get it. That’s life. Very, very few folks are folks who unilaterally pursue one thing their entire lives. And of those who do, they’re not all successful.

Another friend of mine whose track record speaks for itself, having invested and involved herself in multiple boards before those companies became unicorns and even after, once told me that the idea she invests in is irrelevant. As long as it has grounds and can be adjacent to a large market. The primary thing she looks for is the founding team.

Early-stage investors obsess about people. They’re not wrong. Some are misled by these “VC-isms.” Others still have their own way of underwriting them. I don’t have a crystal ball. I’m also not the smartest person to be dishing out predictions. I have a rough idea of what will change, though I may not always be right. But I don’t know how they’ll change. Or when. So I’ve lived an investing career obsessing over things that don’t change. Or as Naval Ravikant puts it: “If you lived your life 1000 times, what would be true in 999 of them?”

I’ve written about flaws, limitations and restrictions before. But to quickly surmise:

  • Flaws are things you can overcome. Limited track record. Never managed a team. Never scaled a product. Limited access to capital.
  • Limitations are imposed by others and/or the environment. Gravity dictates that objects don’t fall upward. There are only 24 hours in a day. If you’re not based in the Bay Area, it’s harder to raise capital. Certain investors prefer co-founders and partnerships. Certain investors care about warm intros. The list goes on.
  • Restrictions are rules imposed on yourself by yourself. Batman can’t kill. You only invest in solo founders. You only invest in healthcare. You don’t invest in anyone outside the Ivy League schools. But some restrictions go deeper. You’ll never hire from a job portal again. You never hire or invest outside of your network. You won’t invest or hire having never met someone in person. You need to meet their spouse before you make a hiring decision. You don’t invest in single parents. You don’t hire anyone who doesn’t read at least one book per month. You micromanage. You don’t hire anyone who cannot curse. And yes, I’ve heard all of the above and more. My curiosity is always: Why do you impose such restrictions on yourself? What is the story you’re not telling me? Is out of a fear or admiration?

All that to say:

  • Flaws will and can change if it is a priority. But won’t change if they’re not.
  • Limitations might change, but it’s outside of your and my control. And I don’t get paid to pray to the weather gods.
  • Restrictions often don’t change.

Whether you admit it or not, certain habits are hard to change and unlearn. It’s possible. But that requires you to not only be aware of it, but also actively want to change it. Other habits are second nature. How you treat others. How you start each conversation. Why you look both ways before crossing even an empty street. Why you’ve sold yourself a particular personal narrative. Why you have to invest a certain thesis.

The world seems to always be trying to stay on top of things, but there seems to be far less dialogue around how to get to the bottom of things. To me, when it’s underwriting a person and their team, it’s about underwriting what doesn’t change rather than underwriting what could.

Photo by Hc Digital on Unsplash


Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

Can Your Check Size Win You Board-Level Transparency? | Apurva Mehta | Superclusters | S6E8

apurva mehta

โ€œA manager doesnโ€™t generally fit into their ultimate quartile until Year 6.โ€

Apurva Mehta is the co-founding Managing Partner of Summit Peak Investments, a fund-of-funds that boasts a portfolio of both venture fund investments and direct investments, including the likes of Affirm, Anduril, Airtable, Opendoor, and Wish, just to name a few.

Prior to starting Summit Peak in 2018 with his co-founder, Patrick O’Connor, he previously served as Vice President and Deputy Chief Investment Officer for the Children’s Hospital Endowment Portfolio in Fort Worth, Texa. From 2008 to 2011, he was the Director of Portfolio Investments at The Juilliard School in New York City. Apurva began his career in investment consulting and investment banking at Citigroup and Lehman Brothers. He was recognized for his expertise when he was named to aiCIO Magazineโ€™s Top Forty Under Forty in 2012 and 2013 and honored as a Rising Star by Institutional Investor. He holds a BBA in Finance from The George Washington University.

You can find Apurva on his socials here:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/apurvaamehta/

Listen to the episode onย Apple Podcastsย andย Spotify. You can alsoย watch the episode on YouTube here.

OUTLINE:

[00:00] Intro
[01:40] Tennis
[02:45] Lehman Brothers’ impact on Apurva
[05:28] What AI is missing in investment management
[14:26] Underestimated qualitative metrics that impact a GP’s story
[22:10] Building Cook Children’s Hospital foundation portfolio from scratch
[30:24] Moving quickly as an LP
[31:32] What does Apurva look for in the first meeting?
[37:20] Ugly sweater Christmas parties
[39:56] Apurva’s favorite ugly sweaters over the years
[41:40] Post-credit scene: What does GFW mean?

SELECT LINKS FROM THIS EPISODE:

SELECT QUOTES FROM THIS EPISODE:

โ€œA manager doesnโ€™t generally fit into their ultimate quartile until Year 6.โ€ โ€” Cambridge Associates

โ€œIf everybodyโ€™s running the other wayโ€”running from the fire, letโ€™s run into it and thereโ€™s an opportunity here.โ€ โ€” Apurva Mehta

โ€œWhen you think about the brand-name firms, they are iconic firms, iconic names. We love the fact that theyโ€™re co-invested alongside us. Even if we could build relationships with those firms, we didnโ€™t feel like weโ€™d get the transparencyโ€”maybe it was because of our check size, but maybe thatโ€™s just because of how they operateโ€”that we needed to go to an investment committee.โ€ โ€” Apurva Mehta

โ€œThe transparency at the brand-name firm level is not as high as it is with the kinds of firms we back.โ€ โ€” Apurva Mehta

โ€œBack then, everything was white space, building around network and ecosystems […] It was easier then because the landscape was less crowded. There were 150 backable or quasi-backable seed funds in 2012. 2000 to 3000 now backable and quasi-backable funds in the market. But it was easier then to figure out what we were looking for because it was just brand new.โ€ โ€” Apurva Mehta


Follow David Zhou for more Superclusters content:
For podcast show notes: https://cupofzhou.com/superclusters
Follow David Zhou’s blog: https://cupofzhou.com
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The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

120 BPM

dj, bpm, beats per minute

I was on a walk with an LP friend recently around Redwood City. And he told me a remark that another LP had about a mutual investor relations friend we had. That our IR friend started the conversation with, “What are your life goals?” And it alarmed that LP who was meeting our IR friend for the first time. To which, this LP told a few others that he was not only thrown off, but also felt offput by the interaction.

It led to a discussion between my LP friend and I where neither of us, knowing this mutual IR friend, would ever think less of our IR friend because that’s just how this person operates. But to someone who has no context of our friend, it would seem bizarre.

One of my friends who, at one point in time, was a full-time professional DJ, once told me, “The golden number is 120. 120 beats per minute. It’s the rhythm that when you strip all the noise away and you can get a heart to beat that fast, it feels like you’re in flowโ€”flow state. Pure ecstacy.

“But you can’t start the set at 120. If your mix is at that pace, and the heart isn’t, it feels discombobulating. You need to work up to it. Start the set at 70. And over the course of a one- to two-hour set, you work your way up to it. And notice the audience. The crowd must be nodding their head to your beat. And if you ever lose that bob, slow the set down again. And try to catch that heart rate again.”

To this day, probably one of the best pieces of advice on how to hold a conversation I’ve gotten to date. And it was never meant to be so.

A question I get surprisingly often is: “Why did you start the podcast?”

Among many reasons โ€” I get to ask dumb questions to smart people, refine my diligence skillset, get better at asking questions, and so on โ€” one of which was that when I only have an hour and change with someone, I’d rather not spend 10-15 minutes on small talk. How are you? How was the weekend? Which seems to be the LLM that’s coded in us on how to start a conversation and hope eventually, you can get to the meat and potatoes of the conversation. And it makes sense.

To use the DJ analogy above, most people’s resting heart rate is around 60-100. To take the middle of the road, 80. And for busy people who are constantly distracted by meetings and tasks that need their attention, a conversation with a stranger is among the lowest of their priorities. So I always believed that people would be near their resting heart rate when chatting with a nobody like myself. As such, they need icebreakers like “How are you?” to warm them up to the conversation, where their first impression of how you answer that question will indicate where the conversation might go.

On the flip side, most people haven’t been on podcasts. Much less, the guests I aim to have on. LPs. Many typically aren’t given the stage. And even if they are, it’s closed door discussions and private events. Rarely, do they get a public stage. So, the hypothesis was that on average, an LP will most likely be more nervous, excited, you name your fair share of anticipatory emotions jumping on a podcast as opposed to an offline 1:1 conversation. Six seasons in, I’d say we’re pretty close to the mark there.

As such, a faster heart rate means I am often given the privilege of starting the conversation not from “How are you?” but a question closer to 100-110 beats per minute, with hopes we can get into the questions that result in 120+ bpm sooner. And it’s almost always easier to ask a question “for the audience” than for yourself.

“Tell us about the time you proposed to your wife via a billboard. And how does that influence the way you think about pitches today?”

“Half your games on chess.com open with the Ruy Lopez. How do you think about opening gambits when you play white. And how much, if at all, does it influence the way you think about opening a conversation with a GP?”

“How does getting your first day in investment banking postponed, which was supposed to be Sept 11, 2001, influence the way you think about serendipity?”

All questions that I would hesitate to say, would be easy opening gambits in a 1:1 coffee chat. But your mileage may vary.

Photo by Tobias Rademacher on Unsplash


Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

What does GP-Friendly ACTUALLY Mean? | Caroline Toch Docal | Superclusters | S6E7

caroline toch docal

โ€œItโ€™s a mathematical reality that the highest performing GPs in this part of the market often also have the highest kill rates, which means some things are incredible and other things are super wonky and you have to be cool with that. You canโ€™t be doing a six across the board.โ€ โ€” Caroline Toch Docal

Caroline Toch Docal backs early stage fund managers as the lead of BCVโ€™s Emerging Manager Program. She believes in investing in funds as early as the first close, which is a rare focus in the LP landscape. Sheโ€™s a lifelong early stage enthusiast from her time at Venture for America to Techstars to Chief to Dorm Room Fund to now Bain Capital Ventures, where she runs the emerging manager program there which has seen quite the evolution since 2017.

You can find Caroline on her socials here:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/carolinetoch/
X / Twitter: https://x.com/carolinetoch

Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also watch the episode on YouTube here.

OUTLINE:

[00:00] Intro
[01:33] BCV Emerge
[02:30] The 13-year summer camp experience
[07:46] From VC to LP
[09:50] Compare/contrast early stage investing to emerging GP investing
[12:51] Behind the scenes of Caroline chose to become an LP
[14:36] Caroline’s first investment
[16:24] What is a GP-friendly diligence process?
[21:27] How Caroline pre-qualifies an investment?
[24:50] Understanding if a GP REALLY believes VC is their life’s work
[26:25] Examples of long-term language
[31:05] The 3 Acts of BCV’s Emerging Manager program
[36:44] What the hell is BGH?
[38:03] Stand up comedy
[39:20] Dogs vs cats

SELECT LINKS FROM THIS EPISODE:

SELECT QUOTES FROM THIS EPISODE:

โ€œOne of the things thatโ€™s not really talked about in this part of the asset class is everything looks pretty good until you see a lot of stuff.โ€ โ€” Caroline Toch Docal

โ€œSometimes people use the referencing phase to get to know people theyโ€™d want to meet. I donโ€™t believe that is necessarily the most GP-friendly thing to do.โ€ โ€” Caroline Toch Docal

โ€œItโ€™s a mathematical reality that the highest performing GPs in this part of the market often also have the highest kill rates, which means some things are incredible and other things are super wonky and you have to be cool with that. You canโ€™t be doing a six across the board.โ€ โ€” Caroline Toch Docal

An example โ€˜long-term languageโ€™: โ€œThey donโ€™t celebrate fundraising; they celebrate outcomes.โ€ โ€” Caroline Toch Docal

โ€œThe average anchor check for a $10-25M fund today is $4.2M. In 2017 when we started, it was less than $3M. So thatโ€™s a huge change. Related, the LP base is just concentrating. Using that same size as a benchmark, they have 25% fewer LPs than in 2020.โ€ โ€” Caroline Toch Docal


Follow David Zhou for more Superclusters content:
For podcast show notes: https://cupofzhou.com/superclusters
Follow David Zhou’s blog: https://cupofzhou.com
Follow Superclusters on Twitter: https://twitter.com/SuperclustersLP
Follow Superclusters on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@super.clusters
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Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

Where Does Intuition Come From? | Yiwen Li | Superclusters | S6E6

yiwen li

โ€œThe intuition part comes from activities of creativity that change your perspective.โ€ โ€” Yiwen Li

Yiwen Li is a seasoned investor with a successful track record of investing in AI, blockchain, and healthcare tech while developing global business partnerships to fast-scale the business.

Yiwen is currently Head of Venture Investments at Bayview Development Group, a global family office with diverse exposure public market, private equity, venture, and real estate. Prior, she was a Principal at Alumni Ventures, responsible for end-to-end multi-stage investments focused on blockchain and fintech. She was Director for Corporate Strategy at Masimo (Nasdaq: MASI). She built an innovation pipeline in healthcare connectivity and data analytics. She was Director for Corporate Development at NantHealth (Nasdaq: NH), where she established the international business division. Yiwen started her career at Capital Group in equity research.

Yiwen is an Advisory Board member of C-Sweet. She served on the board of Give2Asia as the chairman of the finance committee and a member of the investment committee. She was an advisory board member for the Asia Society where she co-founded the โ€œAsian Women Empoweredโ€ initiative. She was recognized as theโ€ Top 50 Women Leaders in San Jose 2024 and 2025โ€, โ€œTop 50 Women in 2019โ€ and the โ€œMost Inspirational Women in Web 3โ€. Yiwen is also the author of one of the best sellers โ€œMake the World Your Playgroundโ€, inspiring women to find their unique path. She is a frequent speaker on innovation and emerging technology trends.

Yiwen holds a Master from the London School of Economics and a Master from the University of Vienna. She also graduated from the Venture Capital program at UC Berkeley and the Private Equity Program at Wharton. She was selected to be one of the ” Young American Leaders” at Harvard Business School. Yiwen is a recipient of the European Unionโ€™s Erasmus Mundus scholarship. She is fluent in Mandarin and German, worked and lived in Europe, Asia, and US.

You can find Yiwen on her socials here:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/yiwenli999/

Listen to the episode onย Apple Podcastsย andย Spotify. You can alsoย watch the episode on YouTube here.

OUTLINE:

[00:00] Intro
[02:07] Yiwen’s childhood
[05:00] Jazz singing
[06:14] The value of learning languages
[09:01] How to build intuition around emerging managers
[14:51] Getting to the bottom of a GP’s motivation
[16:33] What percent of GPs are not in VC for the right reasons?
[19:47] Does success fuel or inhibit ambition?
[24:17] The cost of knowledge is cheaper
[24:56] Competitive edges in the current world
[27:06] Why creative activities matter
[31:21] Advice to emerging LPs
[32:42] Post-credit scene

SELECT LINKS FROM THIS EPISODE:

SELECT QUOTES FROM THIS EPISODE:

โ€œThe entrepreneurโ€™s [life] is a life where youโ€™re eating glass every day.โ€ โ€” Yiwen Li

โ€œFor the first time, the cost of knowledge is becoming cheaper.โ€ โ€” Yiwen Li

โ€œItโ€™s the easiest time to create a company. Itโ€™s also the most difficult time to maintain the competitive edge of that company.โ€ โ€” Yiwen Li

โ€œThe intuition part comes from activities of creativity that change your perspective.โ€ โ€” Yiwen Li


Follow David Zhou for more Superclusters content:
For podcast show notes: https://cupofzhou.com/superclusters
Follow David Zhou’s blog: https://cupofzhou.com
Follow Superclusters on Twitter: https://twitter.com/SuperclustersLP
Follow Superclusters on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@super.clusters
Follow Superclusters on Instagram: https://instagram.com/super.clusters


Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.

$80M vs $800M vs $8B Endowment | Trish Spurlin | Superclusters | S6E5

trish spurlin

โ€œOnce you hit a billion dollars, you should probably consider some sort of internal team. Just to mitigate risk. Thereโ€™s audit risk involved when you have such a small number of people managing a huge pool of capital. Itโ€™s going to differ for everyone. Thatโ€™s probably a good benchmark.โ€ โ€” Trish Spurlin

Trish Spurlin is the Investment Director at Babsonโ€™s $800M endowment, covering private markets investing with a large focus on venture. In fact 70% of their private equity portfolio is venture capital. Quite a unique strategy for an endowment to take. Why? An endowment is required to provide, in this case, the university money every single year, anywhere from 5% to 60% of a universityโ€™s annual budget. And to invest in an illiquid asset class aka venture capital that doesnโ€™t return capital till a decade later, if not longer, takes courage.

You can find Trish on her socials here:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/trishspurlin/
X / Twitter: https://x.com/trishdigi

Listen to the episode onย Apple Podcastsย andย Spotify. You can alsoย watch the episode on YouTube here.

OUTLINE:

[00:00] Intro
[01:45] Sports in Trish’s life
[05:10] How does success fuel inhibit ambition? How does it inhibit ambition?
[07:35] How do you underwrite long term motivation?
[13:21] How fast you order something might matter
[16:04] Can Trish angel invest outside of Babson?
[17:08] Endowment with a $80M budget
[19:54] Should you hire an outsourced CIO?
[24:18] Endowment with a $8B budget
[27:47] Babson’s liquidity requirements
[30:33] How to ask about a senior partner leaving
[34:05] How does Trish build trust with her GPs?
[37:48] Trish’s interests vs Babson’s interests
[45:24] Hank Sauce
[47:26] Why is Ocean City Boardwalk special?
[48:51] What serves as a reminder to Trish we’re still in the good ol’ days?

SELECT LINKS FROM THIS EPISODE:

SELECT QUOTES FROM THIS EPISODE:

โ€œWhat have [ambitious peopleโ€™s] transition periods looked like? A lot of times when people do really cool things, there are 2-3 years after where they just donโ€™t know what to do with themselves. Thatโ€™s very normal. You see that with Olympians. You see that with astronauts.โ€ โ€” Trish Spurlin

โ€œOnce you hit a billion dollars, you should probably consider some sort of internal team. Just to mitigate risk. Thereโ€™s audit risk involved when you have such a small number of people managing a huge pool of capital. Itโ€™s going to differ for everyone. Thatโ€™s probably a good benchmark.โ€ โ€” Trish Spurlin

โ€œIf you want to be told things when they arenโ€™t going well, you canโ€™t freak out when somebody tells you something thatโ€™s not going well. No emails in caps. No yelling. Take a moment to digest what youโ€™re being told. Youโ€™re collecting information. You can discuss that information when the time is appropriate.โ€ โ€” Trish Spurlin


Follow David Zhou for more Superclusters content:
For podcast show notes: https://cupofzhou.com/superclusters
Follow David Zhou’s blog: https://cupofzhou.com
Follow Superclusters on Twitter: https://twitter.com/SuperclustersLP
Follow Superclusters on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@super.clusters
Follow Superclusters on Instagram: https://instagram.com/super.clusters


Stay up to date with the weekly cup of cognitive adventures inside venture capital and startups, as well as cataloging the history of tomorrow through the bookmarks of yesterday!


The views expressed on this blogpost are for informational purposes only. None of the views expressed herein constitute legal, investment, business, or tax advice. Any allusions or references to funds or companies are for illustrative purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment recommendations. Consult a professional investment advisor prior to making any investment decisions.